"Alas Babylon" discussion

[Jerry D Young]

Alas Babylon by Pat Frank

Discussion started by Jerry D Young. What are your thoughts on this story?

Jerry

[Jerry D Young]

Alas Babylon was one of the first of the contemporary nuclear war stories, written in 1959, it was, I understand, quite the phenomenon at the time. And it has been reprinted many times since then. For good reason. It was not only one of the first that put nuclear war in a more or less contemporary setting, rather than some distant future time, it was harshly realistic. Pat Frank did his research, and did not pull any punches about the mores of society at the time. He had written another, earlier story about an imminent nuclear war, but the war was diverted in it.

A couple of years later, Pat Frank, having done considerably more research, and in an effort to prepare himself and his family to avoid the pitfalls of not being prepared for nuclear war pointed out in Alas Babylon, wrote How To Survive The H-Bomb, And Why, a fairly impressive prep manual for its time.

I have copies of both books, if anyone would like to read them, to see if they want to invest in a copy. Alas Babylon is available inexpensively. How To Survive The H-Bomb And Why, not so much. 

I will not post any spoilers until I know several people have read the novel and are ready to comment on it.

Just my opinion.

Jerry

[Clay]

This is a classic, for sure. It's been about 10 years since I read it, but I still have it on my bookshelf. I'll read it again to refresh myself so we can talk more about it.

I didn't know about the other book, I'll look into that one too.

[Glenda KG7MZO]

Received this one in the mail last week.  Once I finish The Road, this one will be next.

[TWP]

I read this long ago and frankly don't recall much about it.  I'll wait until I re-read it to comment.

[Jerry D Young]

When you'all are reading it take note of the part that induced radiation played in the story. At that time, with the weapons available, it was much more of a factor than it would be now. The amount and energy (and therefore range) of neutron radiation that can induce radiation into metals was much greater due to the multi-megaton size of the warheads. Now, for the most part, in ground bursts, the area where metals can become induced with enough energy to become radioactive enough to put off dangerous ionizing radiation themselves is within the zone of total destruction. Not very likely anyone would survive going in to get things that have induced radiation and survive the event for more than a few days, anyway.

However, that does not completely eliminate the risk. Because there are people out there that do not understand the ways and means, whys and wherefores of nuclear weapons, there probably will be people that will go in and get precious metals that are hot and bring them out. For that reason, and the reason I am even bringing this up, is that, besides checking food sources, the need to be able to check items that may have come from within that zone, means a person needs a low range survey meter, in addition to high range to check for fallout radiation.

Just my opinion on one aspect of Alas Babylon.
 

[Shortaxe]

Always been on my list to read and finally got that done. On a recent road trip, put on the audiobook narrated by Will Patton. He really has the voice to make this book seem alive.
It was interesting that the loss of electricity was not portrayed as devastating as the loss of gasoline. When you have a Model T in the book, it's the 50's for sure.
One of the largest that I saw which allowed them a fairly decent time of just surviving was the community. The fact that most knew each other and could band together with shared resources got them all through. That would not happen in today's world in inner cities and probably the suburbs in metro areas. Only because they were a small town made a difference.
As the book rolled on, I could find myself looking at today in their context. Today we don't all have single barreled shotguns and an old pistol. The force required with the Highwaymen for example would much more dangerous.
I do think that given the era this was written, there was a different set if standards and society norms. Nobody took a gun to someone else to get even, crack cocaine was unheard of and there really were guys and dolls.
It was well written, well thought out and a pleasure to read. This is one of my favorites and belongs on the bookshelf.


Vic

[willc453]

Still have my copy of Alas, Babylon but did anyone know there was a tv series (CBS?) based on the book in the 60's? Unfortunately, it's not available in vhs or dvd format any where that I could find. Here's a list of WW 3 books via Wikipedia which has a partial list of WW 3 movies/books if interested, plus others that may not be listed:

 https://en.wikipedia.org/wiki/Category:World_War_III_speculative_fiction

A few notes:
Shadow Of The Hearth by Judith Merril was made into a 1954 tv movie titled Atomic Attack, available on YouTube. Got my book copy via Amazon, EBay or Half.com.....just don't remember where. Sent my copy to Dad who also reads this stuff.

No Blade of Grass (1970 movie) is available as a dvd. Deals with a virus which kills all grass based plants such as your lawn grass, wheat, etc. Animals/birds that eat this, die. Takes place in England.

The Pulse by Scott Williams. Forget this one. Two people attempting to find a 3rd person in thousands of acres of Louisiana swamps, some how find her. Was really good except for the "and they all lived happily ever after" ending. Deals with emp, sailing and effects on electronics.

Resurrection Day by Brendan DuBois--really good book on what happened to the U.S. when U.S./Russia went to war with nukes over Cuba.

When Angels Wept by Eric Swedin just like Resurrection Day. Good read.

How I Live Now--book & movie taking place in England.

Invasion USA (1952) movie available on YouTube

Def Con 4--1985 movie dealing with astronauts stranded on space station when nukes start to fly and what happens when they return to earth. Good movie, available on YouTube.

Panic In The Year Zero! 1954 paid for and directed by Ray Milland about him/family on vacation when nukes go off. Read that this was the earliest movie to not so subtly say a teenage girl had been raped by other teenage males. Remember, back then there was the moral code used/enforced by Hollywood.

Testament--1983 movie dealing with effects of radiation on a neighborhood. Realistic, depressing as heck.

For something a bit more modern, try Day Of Wrath by William Forstchen. Deals with Muslim terrorist in the U.S. working as 5 man teams, killing as many people as they can on the freeways, while others are busy raping/killing elementary school teachers/children.




   

[230gr]

Alas Babylon was “quite the phenomenon” in my life; the first contemporary nuclear war story that I had ever read and at a particularly poignant time. It was during the Cuban Missile Crisis when I was 12. We were required to store 2 weeks of food at our school and we practiced “air raid” drills. In retrospect, really WW2 procedures and not very effective in an atomic scenario. Being in Florida, where buildings are without basements as a norm, the school had no effective shelter place anyway nor did my family. My father had many DC manuals which I looked through but was not really concerned with.
Most striking thing about the book (to me) is that it was set in central Florida; the places described and named where very familiar places and in a setting in which I lived in. What was happening in the book could happen to me but, much more important, a nuclear attack was survivable!             

[WolfBrother]

One thing that stuck in my mind and caused me to look at my preps in a different light was the running out of Salt part.

You can't grow salt, you either have a source or a huge supply.  ESPECIALLY if you're going to be canning, dehydrating etc.

[Jerry D Young]

The salt situation was a major impact on me, as well. Also the concept of 'iron rations', though highly modified from what Randy did.

One of the things that did cause a bunch of confusion in subsequent years was the inclusion of objects subjected to induced radiation. Induced radiation definitely happens, but unless the weapon is a neutron enhanced version, most of the items will be within the blast zone and not very accessible to people with any sense at all. Of course, idiots, just like in the story, will probably go into those zones looking for valuables and wind up not only with massive doses of fallout radiation, but pick up and keep on them objects emitting low levels of radiation constantly, which will eventually sicken and kill them.

I think another of the major impacts was the importance of medical supplies and equipment. And that people dependent on medications that cannot be substituted with alternatives will simply not make it. But needing to put together steak knives and such as a surgery kit was what convinced me to include medical items in my kits that I could not use myself, but that I want available to medical professionals so they can be used on me, my family, my friends, or whomsoever might need it.

Just my opinion.

[230gr]

to include medical items in my kits that I could not use myself

Good point! Medical people who do manage flee will likely have very limited, if any, meds or instruments with them. Having what they need would multiply their usefulness 10 fold at least. The same applies for Dentist; without instruments and drugs, you are back to pliers and whisky for anesthetic.   

[eeyore]

I guess I need to get out my copy before I can comment, it has been over 20 years since I read it, the last time.

I do remember that it did shake me up at the time.  Just like Panic in year Zero mentioned above.

[230gr]

Nice to see you Eeyore!
 
It is dated but a good read anyway and a ground breaker in the day.

[WolfBrother]

I found a .pdf of it.  It's attached.

I am working on a .doc version of that .pdf to maybe improve readability.  I will post the .pdf version of that when done.